I
wanted to begin our screenings with Pedro Almodovar's "Talk to Her"
because I think it represents the culmination of the variety of processes I
would like us to explore in the class.
Mostly
I think the film allows for a very transparent view of what the process of
cultural redefinition of Spain, from dictatorship to modern democracy, represents aesthetically as well as ideologically, in
the evolution of Spanish film, although this will become more apparent as we
see some earlier films.
 |
Pedro Almodovar and Rosario Flores in the set of Hable con ella
|
Aesthetically
it is representative of that process of redefinition because, as we will see
over the following weeks, it is the culmination of a process of articulation of
a very unique, modern, narrative style that builds on the aesthetic traditions
of Spanish and international film and art histories, incorporating elements
from Spanish high art and popular culture –music, literature, film, art— but
also of other nations' (someone in an earlier class commented how the images of
Alicia in the hospital, and her nakedness echoed religious iconography of the European
renaissance). This generates a vision of culture that effectively subverts many
of the more negative aspects of the values assigned to the established
tradition of Spain by appropriating that tradition and giving it a broader
meaning, more in line with the principles of a new, democratic, European, Spain.
Ideologically,
the film can be read as a complex and also highly individualized and insightful
reading of Spain’s struggle to overcome the challenges of deeply ingrained
prejudices. In that sense, Talk
to Her is also symbolic of
the trauma that results from not dealing with unresolved issues (for all of the
principal characters, except, perhaps, Alicia). A political reading of the film
could suggest that Almodóvar presents a Spain that seems to have come to terms
with its cultural conflicts but where prejudices persist not only in the
surface, but also at the psychological level, preventing the society from
healing. The secretary is capable of talking about her bowel movements on the
telephone, but Benigno, Marcos, and Lidia are not able to express their
feelings clearly or openly to each other, with disastrous consequences
–Benigno, perhaps, because the dysfunctional nature of his environment
(fatherless, with a domineering mother-figure have not allowed him to…) the
others, we could argue, for something similar, but would have to dig a bit
deeper into the dialogue to decipher it.
It is
not surprising that the film addresses many of these issues through the prism
of sexuality and gender. During the Franco dictatorship strict social mores
were imposed through education, censorship and information manipulation, that
is, by using propaganda, hiding and/or distorting information. Gender roles
were strictly defined and enforced through social pressure and legislation that,
for example, required a woman to have her husband’s written permission to have
a driver’s license. In the post-Franco years, addressing issues of gender
equality represented a challenge to the traditional mores that were symbols of
the oppression of the fascist regime; in the 21st century Spain the film represents,
these traumas seem to linger in the subconscious of the characters despite
having been, at least theoretically, overcome in everyday society (for example,
nobody is supposed to ask Benigno about his sexual orientation, but the matter
is dealt with in the crudest terms in the private conversation of the nurses.
The reaction of Alicia’s father, a psychiatrist, when he sees Benigno massaging
Alicia’s thigh also hints at the persistence of this dysfunction). It could be
argued that it is precisely the tension between the expected social attitude
towards certain behaviors and the persisting prejudice that is behind
Benigno’s inability to recognize (and even feel and confront) his traumas –although none
of the characters of the film seem to do this in a “healthy” manner…
But it
is also possible that Almodovar is cautioning us about something. The society
that the characters inhabit is not perfect. One unresolved tension is perhaps
represented by how, despite the fluidity of gender roles allowed by modern
society, all the characters suffer from "emotional scars" that are
associated not to direct political events, but to society’s inability to
confront them directly (in the prison, the booth Marcos speaks into is called
“communication”, the center where there are all these strict rules about how
inmates (excuse me, interns) are to initiate communication with the outside
world, an apparently imposed attempt at guiding these prisoners towards
establishing ties with the outside world. This prison communications center
seems to bring even more attention to the emotional damage inflicted by the
fact that the characters live in a dehumanized culture that assigns them roles
into which no one can fit perfectly, and therefore can seem arbitrary. And
although this modern world seems accepting of these characters’ “minor flaws”,
there remains an undercurrent of old closed-mindedness: Although everyone seems
accepting of Marcos’ emotional tears, these still catch peoples' attention.
Lidia’s femininity is openly challenged in the confrontation with the
television host, who insists she has made her way in a male-dominated medium
(ironically breaking the glass ceiling by throwing women like Lydia under the
bus). This suggests stereotypes still weighted heavily on gender roles despite
appearances. Similarly, the nurses’ coffee break conversation, as was mentioned
in class, shows that some of those stereotypes remain in the “collective
unconscious”.
In
previous class discussions, when I have screened this film students have talked
about the moral relativism of the story: We want to hate Benigno for what he
has done, but he seems to be depicted as too nice a guy. But Almodóvar and
society seem to punish Benigno; his life is ruined, he dies. Although Marcos is
his friend, and he helps him get a lawyer, he had warned Benigno of the
consequences of his infatuation with Alicia when the male nurse confessed to
wanting to marry the dancer. The limit of morality seems to be there where
one’s desire runs into someone else’s space: "She cannot say no to you
with any part of her body" Marcos yells at Benigno when the nurse is
confessing his love for Alicia. That sets the limit of personal freedom, the
point at which barriers become necessary.
The
film then seems to address also the pursuit of fulfillment –the desire not to
be alone—and draws on very complex process of communication that do not work
well as absolutes. The film takes a moral position, although it also stresses
how all the characters are flawed. Marcos’ growth seems to sprout from
his acceptance of Benigno’s women’s magazine wisdom, his seemingly candid,
simplistic worldview. Peace might be achieved by the recognition and
acceptance of one's own weaknesses and those of others, and perhaps by the
achievement of a sense of personal freedom through the fulfillment of
desire ("from the earthly rises the ethereal" Katarina tells Alicia
and Benigno).
Is
Almodovar rejecting every myth about gender roles in Spanish society? Does
Benigno, who shares all kind of advice about women ("talk to her"),
really "know everything about women", as he claims? His argument is
laughable, and has echoes of another film sociopath, Alfred Hitchcock’s Norman
Bates from the movie Psycho. Benigno claims he knows all about women because he
"lived 20 years with one and has taken care of this one for four".
But it is the advice Benigno gives Marcos that seems to be the stepping stone
to a new way of approaching relationships, which is why, as we said in class,
we can't hate Benigno despite what he does. It is why we think that now Marcos
is going to have a successful relationship with Alicia, because he has grown,
(which contributes to the notion of a happy ending, although we don't really
see an ending, that is, there really isn't an ending because this is a movie
and the actors wrapped up the shoot and went home).
Perhaps
there are critiques in the story as well. Perhaps Almodovar is telling us that
history is a tale told by an idiot--perhaps made of contradictions-- about the
way gender roles are adopted and performed? After all, the women are not heard
in the film. Lidia complains about it: When Lydia tells Marcos they need to
talk before the bullfight, he tells her: "We have been talking for an hour",
Lidia replies: "No. You have".
Such a
reading, and if we looked at the film as an allegory (a symbolic
representation) of what Spain is confronting as a society --or should confront,
it is being told that it should confront its identity crisis by embracing
itself as a global space.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteRachel Asleson
ReplyDeleteI found “Talk to Her” to be extremely intriguing. The opening scene immediately reminded me of Ingmar Bergman’s “Persona”, as we were instantly introduced to a figure and face with no dialogue, just a frame of a soul with great emotion. The frequent use of the color red in “Talk to Her” was also reminiscent of Bergman’s film. There was a constant underlying tone of passion, dissatisfaction, and confusion, either caused or heightened by the struggle within each character to fit within or outside of the invisible cultural lines.
What I found most interesting in the film was the blurriness or inability for the main characters to be self-actualized or at peace with their identities. Benigno was particularly perplexing. I found myself feeling very unsettled and even a little guilty that I liked him as a character, and I was left unconvinced that he in fact was guilty of a crime at all. Is that creepy? Consciously, I know what he supposedly did, yet I found him so likeable before the rape accusations were made, that it was quite a struggle to change my opinion of his character even after such a horrific crime. Benigno almost evoked a motherly presence with those he allowed in his inner circle; in this case Alicia and Marcos. He gave what could be considered motherly advice to Marcos about life and women (with questionable accuracy) and early on he cared for Alicia as a mother cares for a child.
Placing Benigno in this light as a motherly caregiver makes his actions even more goosebump-inducing, as this denotes an underlying message that we cannot trust those closest to us, and even or especially those who are supposed to protect rather than harm us. The relationship between Benigno and his own mother is of course highly suspect. I think it was Lidia’s sister that said: “if you can’t trust a missionary what’s become of us?” Perhaps this represents Franco’s fear-based emphasis that encouraged remaining in traditional societal roles. Perhaps everyone in the film being “blurry” in terms of identity (good vs. evil, male vs. female, etc.) represented the cultural fear of progression toward the unknown future, or maybe “Talk to Her” simply illustrates the fact that everyone is multi-sided and it is the reality of humanity that we are all a bit of everything.
Matthew Braun
ReplyDeleteThe film, “Talk to Her” is a cinematic expression that seeks to challenge strict gender roles of a post-Franco regime. It used to be that, under the fascist dictatorship of General Franco, there were standards in society for what a man or woman was supposed to exemplify. Fast-forward to Spain’s society today, and the gender roles have become more than fluid, especially in this film. The character, Lydia, is a female world-class bullfighter which is a profession typically held by males. Benigno is a male nurse – which, just by saying he is a male nurse, should be indicative of a dominant female presence in the field. Finally, we have Marcos whom we find crying in many parts of the film, though that is not typically something a male is supposed to do. Let’s put it this way, if Almodovars were to have directed the movie “The Searchers,” we would have seen a crying John Wayne all too often.
I adore that Almodovars attempted to challenge the general stereotypes of male and female archetypes, however, he also challenged the viewer when it came to the content of the film. No doubt, I am still able to identify with Marcos who may cry at points and even allow another man to call him his boyfriend – I allow my friends to call me their boyfriend all of the time – but then the subject matter of rape is introduced and all hope, for me, goes out the window.
Benigno is in love with Alicia, who is in a coma. He is not the only one who is in love with her, as Marcos is too. The only difference between the two men is that Marcos knows when to say no. When a woman is not able to say “no” with any part of her body, you do not take advantage of that. Unfortunately, Benigno does take advantage of Alicia, raping and impregnating her. This is where the film had lost me. I did not want to believe that somebody as caring and passionate as Benigno could rape anybody. I didn’t think he could rape a fly, but all signs pointed to him doing so.
This act of rape reintroduced a stereotype amongst creepy male figures. You want so bad to cheer on this loving character, but rape eventually makes it next to impossible, at least for me, to care at all about a person.
One gripe I may have had with the film is that, although it was supposed to be challenging gender roles in society, it was still predominantly male-centered. Yes, the female lead held a position that is typical of a male, yet we never really uncover whom any of the females are at their core. The movie tends to center around challenging male stereotypes, while barely scraping the surface of challenging female stereotypes.
Although bizarre and certainly unlike any film I have seen in the past, I actually really enjoyed watching Pedro Almodóvar’s Talk to Her. Not only was the film thoroughly entertaining, it also served as a fantastic insight into a bit of Spanish history, specifically regarding the transitional period that occurred after Franco’s dictatorship came to an end. One of the most prominent ways in which this history is explored within the film, is through Almodóvar’s representation of the existent issues revolving around the prevalent stereotypes of masculinity and femininity within Spain after the dictatorship, as well as the profound effects that these stereotypes had on gender roles at the time. With this, Almodóvar is also able to explore the challenges presented by modern and traditional expectations within a contemporary society and world.
ReplyDeleteDuring Franco’s dictatorship, strict social norms were imposed and implemented, both by social pressures and actual legislation, including ones in regards to gender roles and sexuality. With the death of Franco in 1975, Spain was able to drop these norms and progress socially, politically, and culturally; however, as the film so perfectly demonstrates, many of the prejudices persisted well beyond the age of Franco. This concept is demonstrated throughout the entirety of the film, and one of the greatest ways in which it can be seen is simply by taking a deeper look at three of the major characters: Benigno, Lydia, and Marco. To begin, Benigno is a nurse who is also trained in the beauty industry, which are occupations that completely break away from the stereotypical vision of a Spanish man. Because of this, Benigno’s masculinity and sexuality are questioned, criticized, and made fun of by several characters throughout the film, including Alicia’s father and the other nurses. One specific scene where this is demonstrated is when the nurses are gathered in the break room gossiping about Benigno’s sexuality. These prevalent gender roles can also be clearly seen through the character of Lydia. Lydia is an absolutely beautiful and feminine woman in appearance, but because she is a bull fighter (a stereotypically masculine occupation), she is also continuously questioned and critiqued, similarly to Benigno. One specific example of this within the film is when Lydia is being interviewed, and the reporter chooses to solely focus the entirety of the interview on Lydia’s apparent affair with Niño de Valencia. Lastly, these gender stereotypes can also be seen through the character of Marco. On the outside, Marco appears to be very masculine in physique and demeanor; however, he is very sensitive and emotional and cries on several different occasions. Because he displays the so-called feminine characteristic of sensitivity, people end up judging and identifying him entirely by this small element of his personality. For example, when Marco enters Alicia’s hospital room for the first time, Benigno introduces him to Alicia as the man who cried at the theater. By depicting the characters in this way, Almodóvar is also demonstrating the overall issue of modern vs. traditional expectations. Within a modern belief system, these prevalent gender roles should be entirely abolished, and people should be free to possess both masculine and feminine qualities simultaneously without receiving questions or criticism. In stark contrast to this, traditional expectations support the classic gender roles that were defined in earlier centuries. Clearly, by creating characters that possess both stereotypical masculine and feminine qualities, and by depicting the judgment and criticism that is presented to them because of this, Almodóvar is able to demonstrate the power and influence that gender roles and prejudices played in Spain even after Franco’s dictatorship came to an end.
-Kelsey Hsueh
Alex Willis
ReplyDeleteIn Pedro Almodovar’s film Hable con ella, the audience is presented with a story full of both traditional and modern ideologies accompanied by various feelings of emotion. The actors in this film represent several different unorthodox characters whose personalities contradict traditional roles of men and women. It is apparent throughout this film that the director wanted break away from the traditional morals established by Francisco Franco’s dictatorship.
Benigno is the first example of a character with a seemingly feminine role as he spent much of his life at home taking care of his mother, as well as working as a nurse in the hospital caring for Alicia. He doesn’t seem necessarily insecure but certain qualities of his make him appear less masculine than what might be expected of a man. For example when the psychiatrist questions his sexuality and orientation Benigno lies to him and announces he could be slightly homosexual. Putting homosexuality aside it showed a lack of self-confidence for him to answer this was just to hide his affection towards Alicia, a woman he only talked to once before. It seems as if Benigno could have raped Alicia just to prove a point to himself, but he didn’t consider the repercussions and this concept in general is quite disturbing. Lidia is another character whose role contradicts the traditional persona of the past. Even though she is young and attractive, as well as having a flamenco dancing mother, she chose the path of becoming a bull fighter. In public Lidia carries herself with a dominant and fearless prowess but it seems as if Almodovar wanted to show that this was still a farfetched role for woman to play. The reason I say this is because her softer side was shown when she found the snake in the kitchen, as well as when she got ran over by the bull. Fighting six bulls would be a tall task for a man, but it appeared Lidia was overwhelmed by emotions or pressure resulting in her getting run over and put into a coma. One particular thought she might have had at this point would have been dealing with Marcos after breaking up with him. Marcos is the last main character but he plays a fairly masculine role for the most part. The only question I have regarding Marcos is why he was always so emotional. I suppose it could be Almodovar presenting the idea that it is acceptable to show abundant emotion in this modernized Spanish society.
Aside from this main point I got from the film several other aspects that struck me were the music, and time spent away from the main storyline. In my opinion the music selection was great, and it truly enhanced the emotion and significance of each scene, especially the scene with the live band. One part of the movie that I did not understand too well was why large portions were dedicated to the background story of Benigno and Alicia and the silent film. I suppose it provides the audience with some insight towards Benigno’s thoughts towards her but I think it could have been done with a more succinct explanation.
Adylene Silva
ReplyDeleteThe film Talk to Her directed by Pedro Almodovar really played on the fluidity of gender and love. Main character Benigno has a different perspective on love and affection. At the beginning of the movie, it seems incredibly noteworthy of how attentive and in-touch he is with his patient AIicia. It is only when he acts on that impulse that the viewer is no longer sympathetic towards his attentive nature. His sexual orientation is questioned by Alicia’s father when he seems Benigno massaging the patients leg for circulation purposes, but there is something so intimate in the way he touches her and takes care of her. I think that Alicia’s father asked him hoping he would be homosexual so the act of touching his daughter so attentively would not be so disturbing to him. I think this played on the traditional biases people might have had, especially someone from an older generation in a relatively progressive field. Marco is also fluid in his gender role, he often cried from emotion and is something noteworthy about him that even other characters identify him with that kind of unique attribute. It shows how unique he really is compared to the other men in his society especially when Benigno introduces him to Alicia as “the one I saw crying in the theatre.” He is almost presented as a novelty of the contradicting machismo of the time. One of the most enjoyable aspects of the film was witnessing all the different types of loves. Benigno was in love with Alicia, who was in a comma. Marco was in love with character Lydia who did not replicate his feelings in the end, and Marco and Alicia implied by the end of the film. Each character had such a unique perspective to how they viewed their relationships and it became very fluid of social constructs and moral ambiguity that made the film incredibly brilliant.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteTalk To Her Review (Part 1)
ReplyDelete--Xiaoke Qi
The confrontation of traditional social expectation and actual social role was the most impressive part of this movie. Talk to Her started from women’s story, yet it reflected the man’s understanding of women. Director Pedro Almodovar allowed the male characters, Benigno and Marco, to make assumptions of women’s feelings from males’ perspectives or to bring up the traditional female image of the women. Yet, he also added the new characteristics of modern females to his women characters. The contrastive elements sparked flash in the movie, especially on Lydia. Lydia’s first image in the movie was a traditional Spanish lady with long hair, delicate makeup, shining jewelry and pretty long dress, but she definitely demonstrated the characteristics of masculine when she refused to talk about her personal life to support her image as a bull fighter. When she stood on the bullfighting field, Lydia wore bright red traditional Spanish sparking tight clothing that showed off her lines, yet she was doing the males’ job as a bull fighter. The contrasting elements on Lydia’s character implied the transition of females’ role in the modern society. Females are expected to hold the traditional image as a lady, a wife, and a mother, yet they are picking up more and more social roles that originally belonged to males. The same contrast also happened on Benigno. Benigno was a typical man when falling in love with Alicia, but he carried out the females’ social role as a nurse. His patience when taking care of Alicia was very professional, just like the Lydia in her bull fighter role. However, director Almodovar gave these two conflicting characters the saddest ending, dying in/because of their inversed social roles. It was ironical to see the two that carried out their job with such a professional manner end up dying sadly. The only difference of these two death was that Lydia died as a fighter on her battlefield, while Benigno killed himself because of his mistake and the loss of faith. What’s more ironical was that Lydia was never able to tell Marco what she really wanted to say (finally expressed herself through another man’s mouth), while Benigno could tell his friend, the prison director, and the audience exactly what he wanted.
Talk To Her Review (Part 2)
ReplyDelete--Xiaoke Qi
The movie emphasized the importance of communication between lovers in a relationship and between masculinity and femininity in the modern society. Talk to Her never implied a two-way conversation based on the interaction in the two couples. The males still took the dominant role in the relationship, and the women did not have a chance or the ability to express their opinions about the relationship. Marco cried twice in front of Lydia, but he never told Lydia the reason. When he finally decided to open up his heart to Lydia after seeing Lydia’s tears, it was too late to save the relationship. When Marco talked to Lydia, he always forgot to listen back for the lady’s real feelings, like most of the males in the modern society. Benigno’s totally different from Marco, yet he was nothing better. Benigno pretended to be caring, but the truth was that he lived only in his imagination. His disguise only covered up his selfish and weakness. There was no actual conversation between the two in a relationship, symbolizing the lack of communication between masculinity and femininity in society. When first entered the 21st century, the Spain society was confused with the transferring social roles. Men were stressed out to adapt to the changes, and so were the ladies. However, the women’s voice was never heard. The movie started with a stage scene in Café Muller where a man symbolized the saver to women by moving the chairs and tables out of the way. However, he was not aware of the struggle of the women (confusion and unable to express their feelings), and thus could not help to stop the suffering. The ending of the movie cycled back to respond the beginning with another stage scene in which a man gave female dancer the opportunity to speak, but no one was listening. Women were pushed away from the microphone by the wave of men, or the wave of man-dominant Spain society. It was an amazing metaphor to the reality where the women’s voice was rising yet could not successfully be heard due to the tension between opposition from the society and small amount of supporter.
"Hable con ella" de Pedro Almodóvar. Al comienzo del largometraje el velo del teatro se abre revelando a dos mujeres, básicamente con los ojos cerrados, sin decir palabra, danzando al azar topando con los límites de las paredes de un cuarto, y a un hombre moviendo sillas del camino. Durante el desenlace de la historia, el comienzo se convierte en un eco simbólico de lo que ocurre en las vidas de los protagonistas. Primero, el personaje de Alicia esta comatosa (con los ojos cerrados y sin decir palabra) y completamente limitada a las paredes del cuarto hospitalario. En este lugar se encuentra un hombre enfermero, Benigno, que cuida de ella. Al mismo tiempo se nos introduce a la segunda mujer, Lydia, que a pesar de ser valiente al enfrentarse a los toros, es frágil contra una serpiente. Un hombre, Marco, mata a la serpiente por ella, moviendo el obstáculo de su camino y se convierte en su héroe. Los dos hombres hacen actos que benefician a las mujeres, hasta cierto punto, pero en si no cambian la situación de ellas. En el tejido del relato están enlazadas varias interpretaciones porque el relato es un rompecabezas psicológico, histórico, social, y también contiene un juego de estereotipos.
ReplyDeleteEl rompecabezas psicológico se encuentra en el mundo interno de cada personaje. Benigno, tomó cuidado de su madre desde que “era básicamente un niño” formando una relación con su madre donde el asumió la posición de “un esposo.” Según la teoría psicosexual de Sigmund Freud, los niños desarrollan el complejo de “Edipo” (envidia de no tener una vagina) si no logran identificarse con el padre. Benigno intenta hacer el bien y en su mente es todo lo que sabe hacer. Después de la muerte de su madre se encuentra sin la única relación que él ha conocido. La oportunidad de cuidar a la mujer con quien se ha enamorado de lejos, es un reemplazo de la relación perdida con su madre. Benigno nunca se desarrolla socialmente fuera del pequeño mundo en el que ha vivido. Lo interesante de Benigno, es de que, es el, quien le da el consejo a Marco de que hable con Lydia, porque “a las mujeres hay que tomarlas en cuenta.” No es sorprendente que, Benigno, rompiera su ética de profesión médica y que no viera la gravedad de la violación de Alicia. En su mundo interno, ellos dos tenían una relación romántica y el la conocía internamente, sabiendo lo que ella quería.
Marco, por otro lado también sufre de soledad y de perdida de una relación romántica con la mujer a quien aun ama. Marco mata a la serpiente por Lydia pero llora con sentimiento al hacerlo, porque le trae a la memoria una situación similar con su ex-amor. Este héroe reportero, viaja alrededor del mundo, escribiendo de las cosas exóticas que ven sus ojos, pero es solo una herramienta para huir y evadir sus roturas internas.
Lydia, una mujer que ha logrado desafiar a las normas de género al convertirse en una matadora, les tiene pavor a las serpientes. Psicológicamente hablando, Lydia sufre por perder a su padre que “le apoyo” en todo y teme fallarle. También le teme al rechazo de un hombre y vivir sola.
Históricamente, el relato es simbólico a la España de Franco porque el general Franco, al igual que Benigno, pensaba estar haciendo el bien al “imponer” sus fantasías políticas sobre su gente. Franco forzó violencia sobre una España inconsciente, como lo era Alicia. Él bebe es simbólico de la marca que intento dejar Franco, pero nace muerto porque el Franquismo murió junto a su creador (Benigno). Marco, logra superar su complejo sentimental y representa a la España liberada. La escena donde Marco y Benigno hablan a través del vidrio, los reflejos de sus rostros se mezclan, indicando que son “un solo hombre” o una misma España.
Pedro Almodóvar, formó un juego con los estereotipos, volteando las funciones aceptadas socialmente de cada género. A pesar que las mujeres no expresan voluntad en la obra, el final muestra a una mujer sostenida por varios hombres donde uno le da el micrófono como símbolo de una nueva España con la oportunidad de tener una voz y la liberación de los géneros.
Talk To Her encounters gender conflict indirectly through beautiful imagery throughout the film. Foreign films have always fascinated me as they are very different from traditional American cinema, and Talk To Her certainly kept me on my toes. From a female being a traditional bullfighter, to a man who won’t discuss his orientation, this film touches on issues American film have done before, but with more depth and subtle visuals. Almodóvar presents a film with Spain where gender roles are accepted, and when they are challenged, uncomfortable situations arise. The actors portray this image through strong emotions and conversations between encounters, keeping the audience engaged throughout the film.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Professor Feliu-Moggi in discussing the transparency of the process of cultural redefinition of Spain, as the film challenges physical and emotional states of the characters. Almodóvar does a fantastic job portraying this throughout the film with Benigno never verbally discussing the possibility of homosexuality. In addition, the professor pointed out a great point in the beginning of the film where Marcos’ is crying, and nobody says a word. However, Marcos’ tears are acknowledged by the audience as it is out of the norm, challenging the stereotypes of masculinity. The prejudice is seen in the entire film, but are most noticeable in those scenes, as they are a few of the most memorable ones in the film. Last but not least, a bullfighter is normally a male profession, but the film centers around Lidia for a little while, showing her fame and struggles of fighting for her “eccentric” profession (in their eyes). As she challenges typical gender roles, the film does a great job discussing this taboo manners with minimal syntax.
I do not think Almodóvaris rejecting every myth about gender roles in Spanish society, as each actor still carries the stereotypical features one would imagine. For example, Lidia is a very gorgeous woman, who does have a phobia just like anybody else. In addition, Benigno seems to have a normal life, where only people who see him everyday have suspected some peculiar traits about him. I do believe Benigno went a little too far when he said he wanted to marry Alicia thinking he knew women best as he lived with one for twenty years. However, Marcos’ snapped Benigno back to reality quickly because Benigno knew Marco’s was right: he could not marry Alicia, especially not if she was in a coma.
Almodovar’s film Talk to Her was one of the most interesting films I have ever seen. Although the film reflects a society that clearly has issues surrounding gender and sexuality and details the quiet, secretive thoughts about it, I found it extremely loud and blunt. Almodovar really dove into the these topics and did so strongly. I thought this was a great juxtaposition for the film: to make loud all the quiet, silent rules and ideas on gender and sexuality. Not only was this seen in the movie in total but also in the development of Benigno. Benigno starts as this seemingly innocent, selfless man. He seems quiet, peaceful and stable in that role. However, as the film continues, the audience starts to see him in a new light, especially when he tells Marco his story, when we find out he raped Alicia, and in the jail. He becomes rude, unruly, lawless and this makes him loud and unstable. Overall, this reflects how Benigno, his gender and sexuality, begins quiet but, once his character starts being revealed, the quiet isn’t so quiet anyone. He’s loud and disturbs what people thought he was.
ReplyDeleteThis furthers another topic as well: how the people within Talk to Her perceive one another. In the case of Benigno, people placed him within a certain role because he was quiet at first. Nevertheless, once he begins speaking for himself, he starts controlling how other people view him by his words and actions. This is such an important thought for every character because almost everyone is talking about everyone. People are also constantly talking for other people, like when Benigno talks for both Alicia and Lidia, and in doing this they are making assumptions about who that person is and what they think. Yet, when they begin talking for themselves, they gain the power to illustrate a true picture of themselves instead of having someone else paint a picture of them. In all, Almodovar’s film makes powerful statements concerning gender and sexuality and comments on the importance of speaking for oneself.
La película “Hable con ella” presenta visiones estereotipadas sobre género y sexualidad. Primero, vemos como el padre de Alicia, quien era psiquiatra, permite que Benigno la cuide porque sabe que es un hombre que no ha tenido relaciones sexuales anteriormente y que además es homosexual, que según el mismo, es una “falsa” confesión para poder estar al cuido de Alicia, su amor. Pero, por otro lado, los modales y manierismos del enfermero corresponden con los ingredientes de los estereotipos del homosexualismo.
ReplyDeleteEl director de la película aporta una nueva imagen de la masculinidad haciendo una comparación con Marco, un hombre con una masculinidad notable, a pesar de su sensibilidad, sus modales y el tono de su voz, todo concuerda con el estereotipo de un varón heterosexual. Benigno en cambio, tiene actitudes femeninas, además de una profesión de enfermero que en un tiempo no muy lejano se decía que era una profesión solo para mujeres y gays. Durante años se ocupó de su madre y luego de su muerte, comenzó a ocuparse de Alicia. Sin embargo, por el desarrollo de la historia, queda explícito(a mi entender) que no es homosexual. Se ha enamorado de Alicia, observándola por la ventana; al otro lado de la calle, en el estudio de danza.
Por otra parte es interesante como Almodovar juega con los nombres de los personajes; Marco, escribió guías de viajes, siendo esto una comparación con el mundo tradicional, es un moderno Marco Polo en un nuevo continente donde los límites entre masculinidad y feminidad están notablemente delimitados. Lydia, es torera como el verbo de “lidia” que designa su arte hasta poco exclusivamente destinado a los hombres dedicados al corrido de toros y utilizando el nombre. Como otra observación me parece curioso como Almodovar junta a los personajes Marco y Lydia mostrando la escases del opuesto, por ejemplo, lo tierno que tenía Marco, lo necesitaba Lydia y lo fuerte que tenía Lydia le hacía falta a Marco.
Casi al final de la película a Benigno y a Marco los separa el cristal de un centro de detención, elemento real para el impedimento para un abrazo y también, en mi opinión, la regla social de que los hombres que no deben manifestar sus sentimientos por que se arriesga a perder su "hombría". Cuando Benigno es encarcelado y acusado de la violación de Alicia, Marco va a visitarlo a la cárcel, pero sólo pueden verse a través de un cristal. Para poder verse y darse un abrazo, Benigno deberá dejar saber por escrito que Marco es su pareja yendo en contra de las normas establecidas por la sociedad para acabar con su hombría. Ambos hombres derriban la barrera del falso pudor masculino cuando Marco le responde a Benigno que no le hubiera importado si él hubiera dicho que Marco era su pareja. Quizás este punto abriría la puerta a otra zona de análisis, el posible homosexualismo y erotismo en el vínculo de estos dos hombres sin mujeres, pero eso implicaría caer en los estereotipos, porque en definitiva, quizás estos son hombres modernos, ajenos de los pensamientos de la sociedad de las antiguas culturas.
ReplyDeleteEs interesante las contradicciones de Lydia, la mujer torera que quedará en estado comatoso como consecuencia de la embestida de un toro pero que a su vez tiene temor de una culebra que ha entrado en su casa y acepta la ayuda de Marco, que trataba de convencerla para que le concediera una entrevista para el periódico en el cual trabajaba. Los límites entre el coraje y el miedo quedan al descubierto. Lydia viene de una pelea sentimental en el momento en que conoce a Marco, este a su vez, carga con una historia que no le ha permitido encarar una nueva relación. Esta relación muestra una contradicción en los roles de los géneros ante la sociedad, donde se estereotipa a la mujer como la que debe cargar con más años el desamor y donde el hombre es quien olvida las relaciones pasadas con nuevos amores.
Para culminar, en la película, el cuerpo femenino es tratado como objeto de cuidado y de deseo. La violación, en realidad está encubriendo una acción amorosa, aunque Alicia no puede responder a su amor, Benigno llega sostener relaciones sexuales por amor y no por una perversión. El encuentro amoroso de ambos, el cual es relatado a través de la película silente en blanco y negro, donde un hombre, víctima de una poción es reducido y se introduce literalmente en la vagina de una mujer, que ocurre luego de cuatro años de cuidados y enamoramiento por parte del enfermo, que pierde su virginidad con ella. Finalmente, el filme nos lleva a través del tema de la empatía y la simpatía de los unos con los otros pero viendo todo desde la perspectiva “contraria”, desde el género contrario, rompiendo las barreras del mundo tradicional y entrándonos en la modernidad o pensamiento moderno.
No me extraña que la película, Hable con ella (2002), haya ganado varios premios y sea considerada una de los mejores filmes del talentoso e importante director español, Pedro Almodóvar. Porque en realidad, no esperé nada menos de Almodóvar, ya que admiro su trabajo, así también como sus películas que he podido ver. No solamente él contribuye al éxito de la película como director, sino que también el elenco de talentosos actores y actrices, como Javier Cámara, Darío Grandinetti, Geraldine Chaplin, Chus Lampreave, Paz Vega, Rosario Flores y entre otr@s aportan a las cuestiones sociales que Pedro Almodóvar consigue retratar durante la película. Siendo esta la primera vez que veo este filme, me pareció interesante y significativa debido a los problemas sociales y políticos que Almodóvar incluye. Por ejemplo, me ha gustado el concepto que usó varias veces durante la película de las escenas de teatro, al principio del filme y al final. En estas escenas, aparecen mujeres “mudas,” ya que su rol en el teatro tiene un significado fuerte sin decir nada verbalmente. Es decir que en estas escenas, Almodóvar enlaza los problemas sociales que existen entre el hombre y la mujer y su “respectivo” lugar en la sociedad española, con las escenas de las mujeres en la obra de teatro. Analizando más a fondo estas escenas, representan a las mujeres frente a la sociedad española como “menos que” o “inferior al hombre.” Es por eso que las bailarinas no pueden hablar ni expresarse y corren con sus ojos cerrados, esperando a que el hombre en la obra les ayude a hacer espacio para poder moverse por el escenario con facilidad. Desde luego, este concepto se puede comparar con las expectativas tradicionales en España durante la dictadura de Francisco Franco desde 1939-1975 hasta que falleció. Durante la dictadura de Franco, España estaba reprimida como sociedad, ya que Franco terminó con la Constitución y los ciudadanos perdieron sus derechos, especialmente las mujeres. En cierta forma, me pareció que Alicia perdió sus derechos como mujer tras ser violada por Benigno mientras estaba en coma. Es decir que Alicia puede simbolizar a la España bajo la represión Franquista porque al estar en coma, sus derechos, pensamientos, etc., desaparecieron. Sin embargo, no necesariamente es que Benigno represente al dictador Franco, pero al hacer decisiones por ella, violarla y querer casarse con ella sin tener su aprobación, retrata las características de la época del franquismo en términos tradicionales. Desde ese periodo se recalcaron mucho más los roles entre el hombre y la mujer. Se “definieron” en una forma negativa lo que significa el propósito de ser un hombre machista. Estos conceptos aparecen durante la película, pero en una manera diferente como en el personaje de la torera, Lydia, quien automáticamente simboliza a una mujer fuerte y valiente, ya que su profesión se identifica como una profesión masculina y de “macho.” A pesar de su imagen fuerte y valiente, Lydia es criticada continuamente en su vida personal, particularmente romántica, para poder en alguna forma representarla como una mujer típica e inferior frente a la sociedad, ya que en los ojos de los demás hombres, ella no es competencia seria por el simple hecho de ser mujer. En realidad, cada uno de los personajes de la película representa ciertos aspectos de la España reprimida durante el franquismo así como una España más moderna que trata de aceptar las cualidades masculinas y femeninas de las personas, sin tender que categorizarlas en sólo una cosa en específico.
ReplyDelete-Bianca Soto
David Lopez
ReplyDeleteHable Con Ella
De todos los temas que se encuentran en la película de Pedro Almodóvar Hable Con Ella, el más profundo es el tema del género; la película juega con el tema del género de una manera muy distinta, que se hace imposible de ignorar. Típicamente, los hombres son masculinos y las mujeres femeninas y particularmente en los países Latinos, donde se está acostumbrado a que los hombres sean “machos”. Muchos asocian ciertas características para géneros y creamos estereotipos, en muchas sociedades, como la de España, un hombre debe ser masculino y nada femenino. Pero esta película falsifica estos estereotipos porque, en la vida real, es normal que un hombre sea masculino y, al mismo tiempo, que sea un poco femenino. En Hable Con Ella los dos personajes principales son hombres y no son totalmente “machos”. Marco tiene un apariencia muy masculina, es alto, calmado, y tiene un cuerpo robusto. Al principio de la película, cuando sale Lydia corriendo y asustada, ya que encuentra una víbora en su casa, Marco entra y sin vacilar mata la víbora, demostrando que Marco tiene un personaje valiente, una característica que se asocia fácilmente a un hombre. Pero las características femeninas de Marco también se anotan claramente. Cuando Marco está en el salón viendo el baile interpretativo se ve llorado, aunque no es algo extremo, estereotípicamente un hombre no acostumbra a llorar en público. Benigno se encuentra con una apariencia más femenina que esa de Marco. Benigno es enfermero, y en muchas culturas eso es un trabajo casi exclusivamente para mujeres. Benigno por ser enfermero, su psicólogo, pregunta si es homosexual, Benigno responde “si”y en respuesta, otros piensan que inconcluso Benigno es homosexual, aunque no lo es. Hasta en la cárcel dicen que los guardas piensan que Marco es su novio. Pero aunque los hombres principales sean femeninos, son más aceptados. Por ejemplo, aunque los otros caracteres anotan que Marco llora, no lo tratan diferente. En caso de Benigno, aunque nunca sea aceptado totalmente porque piensan que es homosexual, por lo menos el gobierno lo anota mejor. Cuando Benigno le recuenta a Rosa que el psicólogo le pregunto sobre su orientación “dice me pregunta que se era maricón, pero como Americano”, representando un progreso de sistema. Si la película hubiera tomado lugar bajo el régimen de Francisco Franco, habría sido ejecutado. Aunque no es ideal como es tratado Benigno, se encuentra con una apariencia más femenina que esa de marca otro progreso.
Domnic
ReplyDeleteThe film “talk to her” is a very good representation of the pinnacle struggles in Spain after the death of Franklin Franco .At the beginning the film, Pedro’s almodovar’s introduces the audience into the theme of sympathy; Marco, who is a world traveler seems to sympathize with Benigno, a nurse who sits patiently at the side of his unconscious girlfriend, Alicia, attending to her needs. Marco on the other also has a girlfriend, Lydia, who is also in a coma. The tragedies bond the two strange men together. This seem theme is seen in the entire film. Marco and Benigno bonded together by the accidents of their love ones. Through loneliness of these two men, the film seems to depict how human being are dependent upon each other for their happiness. Benigno is portrayed talking to a girl she likes but she cannot marry her due to coma. Marco is also separated from Lydia; a bullfighter girl she had come to likes but got involved in bullfighting that send her to a coma for a while before succumbing to death. The film portrays a sharp and cruel theme of a rape of a helpless girl. This can be used to symbolizes the evils of Francisco Franco, the Spanish dictator who aligned with Nazis causing so a lot of death and destruction to his own country. It challenges the social rules imposed by the Franco during his reign and the struggles of the Spain to overcome those challenges. The tragic comedy also shows the conflicts of the society and the female roles in the society. Lydia, a bullfighter challenges the common stereotype in the Spanish society. The bullfighting is common in the Spanish communities but it was unconventional to see a female bullfighter. A religious element is also seen when the wedding of Marco’s ex-girlfriend is showed and officiated by the priest. The film did a great job of portraying Loyalty in a society full of many conflicts. The theme can be seen more when Marco is the only person to help Benigno.
Pedro Almódovar’s Talk to Her reflects the stereotypes between men and women. Throughout the film are moments revealing the traditionalist values how men and women typically act by those standards. During the Franco Era in Spain women were expected to obey their man. The man of the household takes charge and speaks for the women. Almódovar displays this in the way that the woman remain in a coma. The only way to know anything about the women is through the interaction with the men in their lives. The women do not have a true voice of their own. Then each of the men represents different ideals of men. Benigno is one extreme in which he controls women. He tells what Alicia is thinking and of her desires. Marco is on the other side, where he is supposed to be more progressing, but he still controls aspects of Lydia’s life. Marco is also in touch with his emotions. Through analyzing the film’s characters, it is possible to see the reflections of time with them.
ReplyDeleteThe women of the film do not ever speak. After Lydia’s incident and her placement in the hospital, Marco comes along to be a translator for her. At first, it does not seem like this is Marco’s intention. Further into the film, it is revealed that Marco attempts to decipher Lydia’s thoughts. He tries to figure out Lydia’s desires. Marco attempts to figure out what Lydia wants without much input from her. Then for Benigno, he constantly speaks for Alicia and her desires. There are parts in the beginning where Lydia speaks, but there is not much reveal on who she is. It is through these moments that show the women do not speak. I believe this is a quality of traditionalist Spain, showing the place of men over the women.
Then men show traditionalist Spain as well. Both Marco and Benigno have their moments where they speak for the women. Despite this, Benigno shows more qualities of traditionalist Spain. For instance, Benigno scoffs at the thought of anyone, including Alicia’s father, thinking that he is gay. He takes whatever he wants without permission. He rapes Alicia knowing that she is unable to consent. Benigno shows the machismo spirit. Through his character it is possible to see the views of traditionalist Spain and the position men had over women. Benigno’s actions cover thoughts of progressivism in attempting to show that women do not have a choice.
Response from Jahlysa Wilson
Marcos Willman
ReplyDeleteIn the film Talk to Her many topics arise through the amount of depth found in the film. Throughout the film we see how the director, Pedro Almodovar, challenges traditional expectations of masculinity and femininity through the various characters in a variety of scenes.
Personally I very much enjoyed the film. I enjoyed the role of Benigno, the love he has for the comatose Alicia can certainly be viewed as very strange and perhaps unhealthy. Given Benigno’s upbringing and the way he spent the majority of his life caring for his mother, to him his love and the relationship he had with Alicia did not seem strange in the slightest of ways, to him that is how one is supposed to care or be in a relationship with another, at least one way of caring for someone. When Benigno first tells Marcos that he wants to marry her and Marcos explodes telling him that she is incapable of saying I do with any part of her body, it seems as though Benigno is incable of completely understanding. Proving that the cause of his actions and desires are psychologically found deep from past traumas.
We see how Lydia lives as a courageous bull fighter in the Spanish arenas and is unable to express her feelings, and then we see how Marcos finds himself crying at a variety performances, be it music or a play. Specifically he cries at the beginning watching a play and we see him crying again at a gathering where live music is being played, among others. These examples in our modern world are not viewed as shocking by any means, since in our day and age the lines between masculinity and femininity are somewhat blurred and become more and more ambiguous throughout the years. In a traditional sense these behaviors would not be so easily tolerated. Traditionally men are not ever supposed to be seen crying or shedding any tears; men are to be viewed as tough and without emotion. Where women were expected to only to stay at home and be housekeepers not to leave the house without permission and to always be submissive to some extent. Pedro Almodovar does an excellent job in challenging those expectations from traditional times and showing the ways in which these boundaries are slowly diminishing in our modern day world
Marcos Willman
ReplyDeleteIn the film Talk to Her many topics arise through the amount of depth found in the film. Throughout the film we see how the director, Pedro Almodovar, challenges traditional expectations of masculinity and femininity through the various characters in a variety of scenes.
Personally I very much enjoyed the film. I enjoyed the role of Benigno, the love he has for the comatose Alicia can certainly be viewed as very strange and perhaps unhealthy. Given Benigno’s upbringing and the way he spent the majority of his life caring for his mother, to him his love and the relationship he had with Alicia did not seem strange in the slightest of ways, to him that is how one is supposed to care or be in a relationship with another, at least one way of caring for someone. When Benigno first tells Marcos that he wants to marry her and Marcos explodes telling him that she is incapable of saying I do with any part of her body, it seems as though Benigno is incable of completely understanding. Proving that the cause of his actions and desires are psychologically found deep from past traumas.
We see how Lydia lives as a courageous bull fighter in the Spanish arenas and is unable to express her feelings, and then we see how Marcos finds himself crying at a variety performances, be it music or a play. Specifically he cries at the beginning watching a play and we see him crying again at a gathering where live music is being played, among others. These examples in our modern world are not viewed as shocking by any means, since in our day and age the lines between masculinity and femininity are somewhat blurred and become more and more ambiguous throughout the years. In a traditional sense these behaviors would not be so easily tolerated. Traditionally men are not ever supposed to be seen crying or shedding any tears; men are to be viewed as tough and without emotion. Where women were expected to only to stay at home and be housekeepers not to leave the house without permission and to always be submissive to some extent. Pedro Almodovar does an excellent job in challenging those expectations from traditional times and showing the ways in which these boundaries are slowly diminishing in our modern day world
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteEl tema mas importante en la pelicula es el subjeto de la soledad - en un nivel nacional e individual. Y la disfuncion que ocurre cuando este problema no es cuidado adecuadamente. Dentro de la historia, Marco y Benigno son el mismo hombre en un sentido. Ellos tienen experiencias de la vida diferentes, pero cada termina solo y tener que preocuparse de sus propios asuntos emocionales. Ambos tienen mujeres importantes en sus vidas. A causa de disfunción en sus relaciones, tienen problemas que no pueden resolverse.
ReplyDeleteMarco parece ser la persona socialmente competente y más contemporánea, pero su estrecha relación con Benigno es una pista que ve mucho de sí mismo en su torpe amigo. La razón de su profundo interés en los eventos en la vida de Benigno no es simplemente que Marco es un buen tipo. En cambio, es porque cree que él comparte muchas cualidades con este enfermero que está en amor con una chica en coma. Mientras que Marco no expresarse en la misma forma como Benigno, hay una profundidad equivalente de soledad, y encuentra la expresión de su dolor a través de lágrimas. Marco continuamente es reprimir sus propias emociones, que le da una marca diferente de loco en contraste con Benigno, que es más obvio en su rareza.
Creo que estos dos individuos son una representación dual de España liberado, que trata de adaptarse después de la regla de Franco y de los valores tradicionales. España sabe que es diferente al resto del mundo y tiene miedo por la posibilidad de interactuar con otras naciones porque su torpeza podría ser revelado. Sin embargo, como Marco, España es capaz de fingir, pero esto conduce a la represión de su verdadera naturaleza - que tiene otras consecuencias. Este país ha sido mucho como Benigno, ha sido confinado en una relación disfuncional por años. ¡Pero el mensaje es esperanzador! A través de Marco y Benigno, vemos dos futuros posibles: uno en los problemas pasados de España sigue a atormentarlos y conducirá eventualmente a la destrucción de la entidad (Benigno) o una realidad en la que aprender de los errores del pasado y son capaces de avanzar y finalmente la esperanza de establecer una relación estable y fructífera con el resto del mundo (Marco). Al final de la película, se supone que Alicia y Marco comenzarán una relación, y si bien hay una silla vacía entre ellos (que representa la presencia de un Benigno disfuncional) nos da la impresión de que el futuro aún puede ser hermoso.
Scott Weaver